Dildo, etc Fall fans attend gigs, don't listen to the music, in fact are incapable of listening to the music; they enjoy what they see and hear...then god damn it.. they have the temerity to post that they enjoyed it on this Forum. They do not have two brain cells to rub together

Alternatively we have the smug self satisfied music critics who believe that they can recognise a dead horse when they see one. These people know they are right and will call all others names in an attempt to bring them round to their (correct) point of view. They attended Bilston/Sheffield/Cardiff* gig and were dumbfounded that people even bothered to clap.
Another spin of Hex anyone?

* Insert any venue on any tour since 1983

Proud to have been a Gobshite Fanboy Wanker although my drug of choice is The Fall. :)

Like I say, I have sympathy with the likes of The Acute who seem to end up getting stuck with the short end of the end the stick with regard to late starts, crap beer, &c &c, but the idea that the Fall's music is in some sort of terminal decline, based on the evidence of recent concerts and recoridngs is frankly bizarre-and while anyone is free to stop listening to the Fall, there really is no need for them to be quite so rude about it. :D

Acton High Street
Gobshite Fanboy Wanker since 1992

Neither of the above. I see the remarks about "going through the motions" and poor MES attitude for the gigs as being the most accurate. I've reached my live limit recently, yet I still consider myself as a huge fan and shall still slavishly buy all the albums and stuff and bore everyone i know rigid about how brilliant the Fall are. Mr Smith's performances are well below par and I can't watch now because I'm too upset. It's undignified, he needs telling and there's nobody who dares tell him. Where are his friends? I've been amazed reading the reviews, I'm worried about the big focus on knob twiddling, mic stands etc - how dull does a gig have to be where these are it's most memorable moments?

I've read too many bad reviews about nothing. Silly really.

I'm sorry folks, but I need to distance myself from the comments about MES in the above post. At the Liverpool gig last Friday, he was the most engaged, and clearly enjoying himself, that I've seen him in many a year. I think the more naysayers who've reached their live limit and decide to stop going to the shows, the better. You people are wasting my good time. We don't need a bunch of moaning tossers fouling the atmosphere at Fall gigs - far better to have people who are there to enjoy themselves and create a decent atmosphere for other, likeminded souls.

And, sorry again, if you think the 'live mixing' is the most memorable part of a gig, then again you're wasting my and everyone else's time. It's a rock & roll show, for fucks sake. Fair enough to have a moan if they're on late and you've got to get home to let the childminders away - but the band's on cracking live form at the moment, and if you can't find it in yourself to credit that... bye then. Again, if you're just a noodly chinstroker and want The Fall to be all about leftfield Hip Priest-esque arty numbers, you're watching the wrong band, they haven't done that sort of thing for as long as I've been going to the gigs. Just wait for the next Jandek tour, that'll do it...

Amazing how vehement the reaction is against anyone who dares to speak against the legend.

Talk about closing ranks. What are you scared of? Feeling the same way I do now?

I fear nothing :lol:

I fear people with views other than my own. Obviously. :D

you can always give the Fall a break if you've gone off them, it's not like hard to do, going to see another band. I mean 10 gigs on the trot. I would have given up after 3. Unless of course you've got some form of wierd addiction thing... to something you don't actually like. Therefore see a specialist, they're free on the NHS. You can get patches nowadays.

I wonder if they have these types of discussions on Status Quo forums :lol:

I agree with acute. The Fall/MES/My Granny have been "mailing it in" for a while live . I'll worship MES on record forever. That's where him an' granny excel.

I love The Fall primarily coz of MES.
The concept of the group and the drive, both of which absolutely amaze me are due to his talent/genius and personal make-up. If he wanted to take the group into a vastly different area, which pissed off/disappointed every single "Fall fan" (including me), then I don't think any of us has the right to question it along the lines of "This isn't what The Fall is about", he created the fucking group, we fell in love with something that was his creation. He doesn't owe us anything in return and we don't owe him charity or condescension should we no longer respond to what he does.

The Fall, in its essence, is one of the most genius fucking bodies of work I've ever encountered, and that includes RPTLC.
In short, I trust MES' judgement (based on 30 years of not putting a foot wrong), I trust his intelligence (based on 30 years of being more clear-sighted than virtually any other writer), I trust his talent (based on 30 years of producing some of the most consistently brilliant songs/LPs) and I trust his work-ethic (based on 30 years of solid-touring and material).

I've only been a fan since 2004, so I can understand older fans becoming increasingly despondent when each new LP seems a far-cry from what they expect, but I still think the music is amazing and MES' lyrics are still light-years ahead of most in terms of substance and originality. So I'm not jumping ship just yet......

I s'pose this means I worship MES on my knees...fine by me!

Only been on the forum sporodically these last couple of years, 'cause my life is too busy to spend as much time here as I would like, but with the tour and approaching album, I came along to enjoy the banter, however, some of the criticism I've found astounding.

Saw the band last week in Sheffield and they were excellent. Spent the last 6 days listening to Bilston and Cardiff, to me it seems great, only wish I could see 'em again tonight/tomorrow etc etc.

I can understand panning the band if they deserve it, but come on, the present line-up have got something to contribute - give 'em a fucking chance.

Once every year The Fall are coming to Germany. I encircle these days in my calendar with red ink, take the next day off when possible, spread the word amongst my friends, give the venue nervous phonecalls about when the ticket-sale does start and, whilst doing so, I talk like an excited schoolkid. I plan to carry on with that behaviour.

I would like to install this behaviour on a second leg...
B for Berlin
C for Cologne

:whistle:

Sorry, Michael, just noticed I did what I'm always trying to avoid - seeing this very town as the heart of the land. Which is criminally one-sighted, if truth to be told.

Someone who likes the fans more than the music. These days.

ENA:EDIT: By these days I mean since the band broke up in 1998 and became the MES experience with other people.
Though I LOVE the line up of the past 18 months and the last CD.
Yes. (PHEW>>>) Oh yes.....

Differing opinions makes the forum much more interesting. We need both the dildo fanboys and the smug know-it-alls... :D

Myself? Somewhere in the middle I suppose - I think nearly everything they've done is fantastic, but each album and gig should be judged on it's own merit.
I'm not a 100% convinced with the new lineup and the new material. But I still really enjoy listening to the gig recordings and the new album can't come soon enough. You never know quite what you're gonna get - it might not be what you want - but it might be what you need...
I agree that the trend is not entirely reassuring, but part of the magic is that you'll nevner know when and how you'll be surprised. So declaring them dead? No chance, it'll take at least 2-3 more RPTLC quality albums before I would consider losing faith...

Good or bad - The Fall will always be interesting to discuss.

And the smug know-it-alls willing to jump and discuss anything to get their opinion on the internet,

And Oh mY God, I heard of someone who went to the south of France and stepped in Dog Pooh. Can you believe it.

I hate the French. And everyone else north of the equator. Just for that reason.

I'll be back, you pricks.

Ohh fuck a moth just flew into my beer. Fuckin Labour Government.

With all due respect, The Acute, it's not the criticism of MES that bothers us-he's big enough and ugly enough to look after himself. What can annoy some of us is the attitude-not displayed by yourself, I must say-that those of us who have enjoyed some of the great gigs on the tour are kidding ourselves or worse.

Like I said earlier, no one is defending late starts, over-zealous bouncers or poor gigs-we're just defending our right to our views of recent gigs. And my view is that the Astoria gig on Wednesday was one of the most alive, vital and exciting Fall performances I have ever seen. :applaud:


Of course, if by "the legend" you mean the poster known as Cheshire Cheese then that's a different story-we're all very fond of him, even if he isn't invited to the best gigs. :lol:

In May it'll be thirty years that I have been a gobshitefanboywanker. What was it Craig Scanlon said? You get less for murder. ANd not regretted a moment.

It's the bleeding FALL

Thanks for the reply. It's very much harder to deal with this when people are rubbing your nose in it. How is it that dull and boring for one fan is a fantastic gig for another fan? I can't believe that all the gigs I go to fall into the former category and never in the latter. I can't honestly say I've thought a Fall gig was fantastic for years, really, and this is nothing to do with "look back bores" or any of that "they were better then and the new stuff is rubbish" school of thought. I'm even getting people taking the piss for trying for too long now- if that's not dedication I don't know what is. Cheers anyway.

You need to take a trip to London, The Acute. Aside from The Forum a few years back, we've had nothing but high-quality gigs for years now.

Maybe there's something in the Midlands air that doesn't agree with MES-next time he plays in the Black Country, hide his rider of Banks and plate of faggots and peas and give him six cans of London Pride and a portion of pie and mash. :lol:

Everything has a shelf life really, even the very greats like Aretha and Miles Davis eventually started turning out shite eventually.

When this happens with MES then I don't think most people will acknowledge it as the people on here are the hardcore fans, I just hope MES has the guts to do the right thing and write books or make weird concept albums or something.

Whether we have got to this point already I really don't know. I must admit I'm a bit disalousioned at the moment, the band seem solid but workmanlike and the last album was shite. However I have no idea whether I'm going to love the new album or hate it, which I suppose is a good thing.

I think people in the UK are spoilt anyway. You get to see the band quiote a few times during the year and some people maybe the thrill wears off. The Fall should get out to NZ, Australia, Europe and so on more.

At the moment I guess I'd have to be filed under Smug-Dildo. I appear to be in a minority of one in finding Wednesday's Astoria gig less than wonderful. On the other hand I raved about Hammersmith and Islington (Friday) last year.

I've seen the fall six times over the past couple of years and, in my opinion, found them to be average, brilliant, brilliant, poor, brilliant and average.

That's the great thing about the Fall, you never know what's around the corner. Hopefully I'll be in dildo mode after the Oxford gig on Monday.

Indeed. According to the gigography, they have played a total of three (3) gigs in Sweden, all of them in October 2001. :angry:

Just listening to the wings from cardiff,
Even recting a 20 odd year old record MES was still well ahead of the wave, and if you dont know what the wave is, its probably already passed you.

i agree with this so much it hurts. you have no idea how lucky you people are to see and disect the band on a nightly basis. who knows maybe if i saw them 20 times a year i would be tired of it too but ill never know


that said it is still ridiculous to to condem those who give a different opinion than yours and to start a tounge in cheek poll about it

reeks of junior high school

Again-look at Cheshire Cheese's first post and look at my reply-we're not condemning someone right to have an (admittedly bizarre, IMHO) opinion of the Fall's current music. It's merely the attitude of "I KNOW they're rubbish nowadays and you dildos :D just don't get it." that rankles.

fair enough i can see how that would get annoying

In all honesty, the people who see them the most tend to be the ones who enjoy it the most as well...

... brainwashed you see

are you saying we're on the verge of a Jonestown Massacare at a gig in the not too distant future

I only say what the leader tells me to.

I thought the beer in the Ship tasted funny................thud.

Only twice in Norway, to my knowledge... ('84 and '06) :(

They'd not sell out a 'big' venue, but would fit nicely at a good small stage like John Dee (400), Garage in Bergen or Blaest in Trondheim. Maybe the mid sized Rockefeller (1300), but I doubt they'd fill it..

I would fear those who had views like my own.

I don't think there's much difference between any of us really. There's Fall-fans (ex and current) and then there's phillistines... :D

I just found this old post from a secret prototype message board that was used when the internet was being created in 1984 (by Fall fans, of course):

"Make sure your copy of Grotesque never gets scratched. Ever since Mark married that american chick and let her play in the band they've done nothing but crap. The Fall won't last, and soon all the old records will go out of print. Such a shame, I somehow thought MES was above all that sell-out crap. By the way, when do you think we should introduce this internet thing to the rest of the world?"

I'm a proud look back bore. The Fall came miraculously back to life with The Real New Fall LP, but then MES returned to his half-assed, by-the-numbers, don't-give-a-shit-anymore mode.