Can some one tell me if its viable to build such and army and still be competitive with it? Most of the forums seems to point to 2 main armys one Magic heavy with slann and skink priests the other one with Saurus on carnosaur and a JSOD with spell cadies.

So far i havent seen an army with a slann and a all mighty charriot killer Fast calvary eater warmachine hunter saurus config wich isn't that expensive to get in my opinion.

If you have an something you would like to say about this post, please explain your pros and cons.

Thanks in advance.

My meanest tournament list uses this configuration (note: Spawnings don't display on the link, but the JSOD has Sotek & Quetzl).

The JSOD's use in this list is two-fold: first, he augments the Slann's already vicious casting ability by hunting down and brutally murdering any enemy wizards he can. Secondly, he forms part of the army's 'second wave' - it works around a simple strategy called the honey trap, where the enemy sees the vast amount of points they can get for killing the Temple Guard and try to overwhelm them with large numbers of their units, or else their most expensive elites. When they find the Temple Guard are nigh-on-unbreakable, they are stuck there; the Kroxigor flank-charge in return, netting me a large number of kills, a pair of flank charges and a huge fear-causing unit strength (18 for the Kroxigor + however many TG there are left, thanks to the Totem), so I will probably break every single unit that has charged in - usually either the enemy's most expensive units, or a great number of units. Wash, rinse, and repeat.

The JSOD is useful here for two reasons: one, he delivers 5 S7 attacks, and so can considerably increase the CR I get in the second wave countercharge through his kills, and can usually be relied on to be in charge range of the central combat on any one turn, thanks to his 360 degree LOS and his 18" charge range. Two, he has a 3D6 pursuit move, which none of the other units have - the ability to catch the enemy once they've run (even though the units that got charged by the Kroxigor will have taken a severe hammering in terms of casualties) is very handy indeed.

I also find him to be invaluable in just disrupting the enemy's plans. When you have a S7 loony bounding around your own lines, organising the kind of cohesive attack that is necessary to successfully deal with the Slann and his stubborn pals becomes a lot more difficult. Chariots in particular, one of the most reliable ways to cause massed casualties on the TG, have to hide from him whenever they can.


I think you'll also find the Carnosaur is not as widely-used as you think. It can be fun, yes, but it's almost certainly not a competetive choice.

Chili, am I mistaken or do I see two JSOD´s in your list? :huh: Surely thats a typo?

Yes, yes it is. Fixed now.

Thx again Chilli:

One question, would you ever consider changin the skink priest for anything else? i know that those extra dispells and dispel die come in handy, but is there another option you had been thinking about?

Just think "hmmm if only i had an extra 150 pts for this list i would put...."

also, under the 7th edition rules i just can make up my mind about life lore or fire . life being versatile and fire very agressive. Any pointers on this matter?

Cheers from Cancun.

Not under 6th Edition. Under 7th Ed, I'd consider it, as we're likely to see less high-magic armies out there and the skink is liable to the deadly new miscast table; however, he still carries the army's invaluable scrolls, and the new Heavens lore rather plays to the list's strengths. At the mo, I don't think there's anything that he can be traded for that contributes more than he does himself.

The answer to 'which lore' is 'which army'. Against Wood Elves, I would consider Life to be miles ahead of Fire; against Vampire Counts, completely the reverse. Against Empire, I would forsake them both and go for Metal. Remember, however, that Slann can choose from multiple lores - while spreading your spell rolls too thinly can be dangerous (concentrating on one lore makes pretty sure you get most of the good spells), when done tactically it can also let you cherry-pick the most useful spells from across the lores. This is why I always take the Plaque of Tepok - it lets you do this more effectively (and, with the 2nd Gen's dice-adding ability, effectively gives you another power dice as well).

Your either very brave or very stupid if your lizard list doesn't include a JSOD in one form or another...

Hi Chilli:

I played the army list you kindly provided and this happened.


Fought against chaos-khorne yesterday and slann and temple guard swamped a unit of 9 chosen khorne knights and a hero mounted on a juggernaut, and some how still got 2 temple guards after 3 turns of fighting. :D . Charged the 2 units of kroxigors on each flank after holding the charge, and latter on a rear charge with the salamanders after they where done killing furies.

On the other side of the board, the unit of scouts got out of their hiding place in a forest set them selves just 4 inches away from a unit of 20 chosen khorne warriors with their backs to the forest, slann sensed the opportunity and casted a fire wall in front on them, skinks shoot poisoned javelins and waited for next turn when they would have to charge my 70 pts scouts unit cause of frenzy, hit each model on the unit in the process from running through the fire wall :P

Also managed to store seven counters on a comet of casandora before setting it of :D. This got rid of half a unit of bloodletters half a unit of marauders and some chosen warriors, also killed my skink priest and 6 skink skirmishers no regrets never the less.

All and all a great game (for me that is) but got me thinking. Against Horde type of armies and this list in my opinion being such a small elite force; how can I manage to get a hold on the situation to fight on my own terms or avoid being swarmed all over?

Chaos Army
9 Chosen knights and hero on a juggernaut
20 Chosen warriors
10+Furies
5 Hounds of khorne
10+Marauders
20 Bloodletters

Cheers from Cancun

Man I ended posting a small battle report and forgot the question i had. <_<

Whats the static CR on the temple guard and slann under 7th edition, im still confused with regular and magic banners?


Thx in advance

Brilliant strategy... ;)

A banner still adds +1 and a standard bearer with War Banner would add +2, as usual. And in 7th Edition, an unit banner combined to the battle standard both count in the combat resolution, contrarily to 6th Edition when only one banner was counted.

Unless the Slann is in the fighting rank ouy don't get any CR bonus from is Battle Standard. Also you can't make use of the BSB re-rolls unless he is in the front rank thats to 7th.

So the tactics becomes less useful to some extent, unless you put your slann in the front of course.

Aye, that is the problem in 7th. My approach to it is this: if you're going to need them re-rolls, shift the Slann into the front rank. He's T5 with a 4+ ward save and 8 wounds - if you're already on the defensive, forcing enemies to attack him is actually a good idea, as it saves TG lives and only something in the league of a Bloodthirster is actually dangerous to him. It also gives you a static CR of 6, assuming your enemy outnumbers you, which is always a bonus.

Until you need the re-rolls, keep him in the centre: that way the TG are still able to function as an offensive unit on the charge, and his various unit-enhancing abilities are kept quiet. There is nothing as dangerous in Warhammer as a trap - and the Slann moving forwards in the second round to make the unit cause Fear and up its static CR is a very definite trap.

However, I do believe this is some sort of rules error: the Slann is clearly intended to be used in the middle of the unit, and costing the BSB upgrade at the same as normal when it requires all this jiggery-pokery to actually be of any use seems to me to imply that the 7th Ed. rules changes had an unintended effect on the rule (as it was, you used not to get the CR bonus because he was in the back ranks, but you still got the effects of magic banners and re-rolls). I've been trying to find a way to send in questions to the official errata for ages, but it seems pretty inaccessible.

Raimet: the army functions equally well against horde armies... in fact, if anything, it's elite armies that worry it more, as they have the uber combat troops required to kill all the TG.

Against numerous enemies, you have three strengths:
>Missile fire. The Slann and the Salamanders can panic units left right and centre. By going for a spell selection heavy on straightforward damage spells, concentrating your fire and using the terrain and your disruption troops (Skinks & JSOD) to funnel the enemy attack, you can ensure that the horde is coming at you through a hail of flames: most horde armies are pretty vulnerable to panic, and with the new rules it is possible to cause a lot of panic by routing one unit, as you can get them to flee through their friends.

>Combat quality. Barring the skinks, every unit in your army can fight hard, and many of them cause Fear. Most hordes are quite the reverse. The opponent has to gang up on your units to win, but the only unit below M6 is the Slann. Therefore you should be able to keep your hard-hitting counterattackers clear, while the TG do their usual job of getting swamped - and remember, since you're stubborn, you don't give a fig whether you're flanked or not, but by surrounding that unit the enemy is bringing more and more 2 attack WS4 S4/5 Temple Guard into the fight against his usually low-quality troops.

>Obstruction. The TG unit takes up a lot of space on the board; the other units are all by comparison small. If you march the TG straight towards the heart of the enemy army, and let the others hang back, the opponent will be forced to attack the TG - there won't be enough of a way round them. And once he does, that unit will be surrounded by other units, and become even more of a roadblock: his army will have to try and manouevre his bulky army around a gigantic multiple combat squatting in the centre of the board, while your small, fast units are positioned to slam straight into the engaged units' flanks. The pursuit moves should take you past the line of sight of his other troops, at which point you turn to your flanks and begin the process of mopping up - you should have panicked a fair few of the enemy, you are still putting out a hell of a lot of close-ranged missile fire so can break up any dangerous-looking gathering of their troops, and your disruption troops will now be able to play havoc behind the enemy's lines as they try to turn to deal with the hard-hitters in their midst.

I've always wondered something about this army, though: what if the enemy chooses to ignore your Temple Guard in favour of tackling the rest of your army? A fast-moving army like Bretonnians, Chaos or Wood Elves can easily avoid the TG in favour of the Krox and Sallies, and pretty much any of your non-ranked units will be broken by a charge from either a heavy cav unit or ranked infantry.

They can probably do that, but with over a third of your points in one single unit, that's still a big part of the army. Most opponents will probably not ignore it.

Once a 2nd gen Slann starts casting spells, it must be kinda hard to ignore him, anyway.

.

You can't beat the army without killing the Slann and TG. Simple as.

If the enemy wants to ignore the Temple Guard, they have to be pretty good. That's for two reasons: the first is that it's quite hard to see past the big shiny target of the TG (at tournies, when I'm doing the pre-game run-through of what everything in the army is/does, I tend to run through the Slann's abilities and then say "which is why that unit is worth about 1000pts", which tends to make their ears prick up). And, as @ztech said, the magical firepower of the Slann is very hard to ignore - after the first turn or so, when the opponent's out of scrolls and hanging on by their fingernails, they're usually finding it hard to concentrate on other targets.

The second is that, if left alone, the Temple Guard are a deadly unit in their own right. You want to ignore them? Fine, but you're going to have to get past them to get the rest of the army, because they're sitting in the way. All those peripherals you're aiming for are fast and manouevreable, so you're going to have a hard time pinning them down, and at the same time you have to get your whole army past this large block squatting right at the battlefield's most central point - and unless you've got an army of Chosen Chaos Warriors, you're going to have to do that without ever coming in charge range of them, because they will bulldoze any normal unit they charge, particularly with the Skink Priest tagging along behind and casting Portent of Far after you've burned all your dispel dice spitting into the wind against the Slann. Add to that the fact that you're being harassed by a decent number of mobile disruption troops, that any fast unit that is not also heavily armoured is liable to instant fiery annihilation the second it comes within 15" of the Salamanders, and the large number of disruptive spells there are out there for the Slann to hit you with if your army looks like it's capable of circumventing the honeytrap, and you need a very good player to ignore the Temple Guard and keep them out of the game. Once they're in the game, they either require a large amount of resources dedicated to keeping them down (in which case the Krox, JSOD and Sallies can probably handle the rest of your army), or they will cut through a large chunk of your forces.

Plus, as (I think) Ras was trying to say (not sure if that's a typo there - 'can' for 'can't') - there are only so many points you can get without killing the Slann and his chums. About half the army's points are tied up in that unit, so if you're looking for anything in the way of a decisive victory, chasing the elusive peripherals is not a rewarding strategy.

Which is not to say it can't be done. If this was the kind of army that couldn't be beaten even if my opponent was miles better than me, I would have more qualms about taking it.

Balls. Yes. Typo. Should say Can't.

You can't beat the army without removing the unit because it requires you loosing nothing, which simply isn't gonna happen.

Chili, I'd be awful paranoid about not having the Divine Plaque of Protection on the Slann, or do you just not run into too many armies that are artillery-heavy? Dwarves are reasonably common around here, so it's not that uncommon to run into some combination of some or all of the following: 2-4 S7 bolt throwers, possibly a cannon, organ gun, flame cannon and/or a Anvil. Even the elves tend to get in on the act, with RBTs, or some of their magic bows, not to mention empire...

I'd think that given his point value and the fact that he's an easily-picked-out large target, that leaving him with just a 4+ ward save is inviting getting him sniped to pieces. Not arguing that the plaque of Dominion is bad, it's pretty nice, really, but that 2+ ward save from Protection is just huge.

My personal favorite loadout for my frogs when I was playing lizardmen more often was: Plaque of Protection, Plaque of Tepok, plus Diadem of Power. The diadem gave me more casting dice than did the plaque of Dominion against everything but other magic-heavy armies.

As for the army's effectiveness, I can guess it'd work pretty well. :) I can see how I'd want to go after it with my current Khornate army, by using my speed advantage to snip off pieces in detail. Not to mention, being Khorne means I have 8 or so dispel dice, so that at least partially negates the magic advantage.

Going back to the original question in this thread: Yes, I'd take a JSOD with a 2nd generation Slann. There's just too much that it does for you to leave it out. I'd even include a L1 skink priest with 2 scrolls for extra magic defense (and might even give the JSOD the spawning of Tepok instead of Quetzl). Skink probably will never cast, but he hangs out somewhere with good lines of sight, to allow the Slann to fire off LOS-necessary spells at spots the Slann itself can't see.

8 wounds, T5 and a 4+ ward save tend to see me through. If it looks dangerous, I go for Shadows, change whatever spell I get to no. 1 (Steed of Shadows) and catapult the JSOD 38" into the midst of their artillery on turn 1. While a continued bombardment can bring him down, it's hard to do when there's a combat monster rampaging through your war machines.

You'd be amazed at how little dispel dice help. The armies I fear are those that, for reasons of paranoia, are carrying big boxes full of scrolls - if all you have going for you is a large number of dispel dice, you're in trouble, because the Slann's add-a-dice ability burns dispel dice extremely fast. Not only does it combine well with the +1 to cast ability to ramp up the casting total of each spell to obscene levels (I've cast high-level spells on totals of 20+ on many an occasion), but it also means that I use my power pool up slower than you use your dispel pool, as one of the dice in each of my spells hasn't come from my pool.

It's not a nice rule. I imagine it will be changed come the new book.

:blink:

I start to understand why those big frogs are so expensive...

Had another battle this time against dwarfs:

My opponents army consisted on:

6 pieces of artillery 3 cannons 2 repeater bolt throwers and organgun
2 units of 12 crossbows
2 x 20 warriors
Engineers
Runelord
Gyrocopter

I wont comment much on my opponents army composition (right or wrong) but I think his strategy is to shoot hoping to have such a small treat at the end, that warriors with regular equipment wont have much trouble.

Any how, one of the main concerns was deployment we had each, 2 pieces of scenery and I deployed 2 forests and got to keep that side for my deployment. In the end I had to set my army on the side that allowed me to place the slann and kroxigors in their usual formation, one on each side, and ended deploying my army entirely on the right side. Keeping to the piece of woods to cover my left flank from early cannon shooting.

Dwarfs deployed on a single line setting pieces of artillery conveniently on houses used for mordheim destroyed on one side, 2 stories high and the entrance on the back so I had to go around to charge them.

Latter one poor thinking got my JSOD to get shoot by 2 cannons. I just can seem to use single characters I really hope this will improve to my benefit that is the 2 cannon balls bounced killing in the process my skink priest and 2 salamanders on the other side of the forest (there goes caddy,skirmish screen and shooting possibilities).

After my opponents first turn I had loosed JSDO Skink priest, 2 salamanders and 8 of my scouts. I had a sinking feeling and was tempted to concede but decided to see it to the end.

Dwarf player decided to move his warrior units forward hoping to charge either lonely salamander or skinks protecting one of the unit of korxigors. I decided I had to be more aggressive an get into combat ASAP marching forward all and setting to charge with kroxs the organ gun in front of me and behind hardcover wich lets my opponent strike in initative order. I then marched forward my temple guard and then lone salamander with 8 remaing handlers to the side of the warriors with their flank to a cannon .

Te remaining turns consisted in kroxs trampling organgun and crew, temple guard charging the warriors, TG won their combat but the dwarfs held.

My second unit of kroxigors that had been left behind because of the forest in my deployment zone had them making some twist and turns to keep up with the slanns unit, but set them selves to charge a cannon when the static CR and wounds would brake the unit of warrior they were fighting.

Temple guard managed to autobreak, pursuit in to the other unit of warriors, then breaking those and pursuing into a unit of dwarf crossbows in roll of 11 on the dice. After the temple guard had aligned they were now facing my opponents table edge and I got to fight them on my 5th round. Behind that, Oh yes!!, a tasty runelord that never thought my lizards would get that far.

Kroxigors that charged and killed the organguns crew pivoted and entered the back of the building were the 2 bolt throwers where, and set them self 1 inch in from them hoping not to get shoot to pieces and getting a chance to charge them latter on, wich didn’t happen, 2 bolt throwers shots after and a single krox falling their ld test was running. The other kroxigors survived thx to the salamanders being shoot by another cannon instead, and charged on my 5th turn also.

By that time I had 7 remaining skinks with javelins doing as much damage as they could but setting themselves to capture any possible quadrant.

At the end of my 6th turn charged against the runelord did 1 wound got 2 in return won combat and pursued of the table edge eliminating the treat of further shooting against slann that had by that time 4 wounds left, remaining krox won combat against cannon crew and pursued off the table. And that was it. Ended up with 508 over my opponent wich gave me a marginal victory. Fin

PD magic was ineffective most of the battle having poor choices on life lore (no howler wind, no rain ) and the spells that got out, were dispelled with scrolls (he had 5) and I was left with only 2 offensive spell

I had a great time and got to learn more about this army list, I still have a feeling that I just not playing my magic fase the way its supposed to be.

The magic is a tricky balance to keep - you've got to make sure that none of your spells are dead weight, and that they're doing the right job, which varies from battle to battle.

Against dwarfs, I would have chosen 4 spells on Metal, and 1 on Shadows, which I would have changed to the Steed: this is my default against artillery-heavy armies, as it lets the JSOD hit their war machines on turn one. I will move the JSOD 18" forwards, move the TG 8" forwards directly behind him, go through the magic phase as usual to draw out dice and scrolls until the enemy's defence is worn down, and then with my last dice (adding one, of course) charge him 20" into the nearest cannon/bolt thrower/what have you that presents itself.

Metal is a good lore to choose against dwarfs because it has a high number of spells that will be useful throughout the game: Distillation of Molten Silver is a very good magic missile, Law of Gold is good against runic trickery, Spirit of the Forge is deadly against heavily-armoured Dwarf infantry, and Rule of Burning Iron is perfect for sniping Runesmiths and other characters - but most importantly, Commandment of Brass lets you shut down individual war machines, giving you a brilliant strategic ability for a very low casting value. There's only one spell that has limited use, and even then, once you get into combat, Transmutation of Lead is going to be very handy.

There are two key considerations when choosing lores: is there a good ratio of spells I want to spells I don't (so that if you roll badly for spell selection your magic phase will not be crippled), and are there enough spells that will be useful throughout the game to allow me to break down his magic defence early (so that you don't end up with half your spells only working on units in combat and leaving all his scrolls intact for the vital turns)?

I agree with Chili, except I would have rolled more on Lore of Shadows for the chance of getting Pit of Shades. Basically, everything under the template has to take an initiative test or die outright: against I2 Dwarfs, this spell is absolutely EVIL. Cast it on the Runelord and laugh evilly as the stunty fails his test and gets sucked into the void.

Unseen Lurker is also useful, however, if the Anvil of Cheese hits you with that missile spell that prevents your unit from marching.

You think it's evil against stunties? Try it against Ogres, Trolls, Saurus characters, a Tomb King, a Giant or, worse yet, a Zombie Dragon or a Slann...

Or Lord Kroak himself... :blink:

anvil of chesse? it used to be a lot worse, but nowadys it is nerfed, bigtime. only one rune per turn. Its pathetic.

Burro Boskov

Yeah, but in the previous edition, it could at least be dispelled, and while its runes were nasty, they couldn't do stuff like, say . . . prohibit your enemies from marching or make your own units move. Actually, it's the former rather than the latter that annoys me, since it makes the Dwarf SAD army even nastier. The Anvil has just become too much of a no-brainer, IMO (though I'm not one to talk about no-brainers, what with me being a JSOD user).

Come to think of it, doesn't Thorek Ironbrow have a rule that lets him re-roll misfires on his Anvil? I know that a lot of Dwarf players seem to like using him (and some even bring him to tourneys).

Can any one post their tactics for playing efficiently with the JSOD under 7th edition respecting the changes in targeting rules?

Do you place it in a unit?
Rush it to the nearest scenery?
Set it behind other units and risk to been shoot at from higher ground?

If you had any games you felt you just hitted the spot using you bouncing saurus, please feel free to post them.

Cheers from Cancún.

Against most enemies, I don't have to worry too much about shooting: with T4, a 2+ armour save and a 5+ ward save, he tends to be pretty bulletproof. If the enemy do get through his extensive saves, not only have they got to do it twice to get him to pop his clogs, but it requires a great deal of effort that would be more profitably spent elsewhere.

That being said, there are situations where this kind of attitude doesn't work: in these situations I rely on two strategies.

The first is to make it too risky to shoot the JSOD: in this army in particular, if you don't think you have a good chance of killing him, it's something of a wrench to try and shoot him when you have the Temple Guard and Krox waving their "shoot me!" banners over their heads. So I bounce him into the edge of forests or behind obstacles, where he can still see to charge, but where attempts to shoot him will rack up an awful lot of penalties - this works particularly well if you position him so that only some parts of the enemy missile force can actually see him to target him, making it even more of a high-risk situation for the opponent in terms of waste. Good shooty players hate wasted shots, and shots on a well-protected independent character with a large number of to hit penalties are in great danger of being wasted.

The second is to use skink units as 'stepping stones' - while the Trapdoor Spider trick (hiding him in a Saurus unit to make him look as if he's not a JSOD and catch the opponent by surprise) will often fool a player the first time you use it, it rarely if ever works twice, and severely limits his manouevreability until you spring it. With skinks there is no such problem: he can start the game in a non-scouting unit of skinks, move in the first turn to join a scouting unit that breaks from cover, run up the board in the second turn with the scouting unit, then charge out on the third turn to hit the enemy war machines without ever breaking from the cover of his skink cannon fodder. A skink unit costs 60-70pts, and is usually going in the same direction as the JSOD anyway - towards the enemy flanks and rear.

Sure, maybe the runes are nastier, but only one a turn for a 400+ unit seems an awful waste to me. Theorek rules have changed, he hits on a 3+ for ancient power runes instead of a normal 4+.
Yes, the ability to make flyers walk have given it an advantage. And the ability to reroll fear and terror tests are nice, and sure the extra march move/charge is good too, but only one rune per turn! Actually, after talking about it, im tempted to give my anvil another try.

As for the JSOD, i dont know much about it. My Lizardman opponent hasnt figred out that potential.

Burro Boskov

I'm not a dwarf player, so my perspective is perhaps a little off, but personally I would gladly pay 400pts for something with that ability.

The problem with conventional magic is that your opponent has the initiative come your magic phase: you have to roll to cast before he has to decide whether to dispel or not, and he knows what spells you have and can evaluate which ones are important and which ones are not. Crucial, game-winning spells like movement spells (an example of which the Anvil possesses) have to run the gambit of the opponent's foreknowledge: if you have Commandment of Brass and your opponent has just set up his character mounted on a chariot for a crucial flank charge, or if you have Unseen Lurker and one of your units of shock troops is sitting a few inches from an enemy's flank, then you either have to power the spell through with as many dice as possible (risking a miscast and still at risk of being stopped), or try to dummy your opponent into wasting his dispel power on other, less critical spells, which is difficult at the best of times.

The ability to just drive a spell through each turn with no chance whatsoever to dispel is immensely valuable.

But then look at cost value, 400 points for one spell, or maybe 200 for the maybe 4. Sure there is a chance you can explode, but there is a chance for the anvil too.

I guess you are right though, the ability to cast those spells is preety nice, its just it was so nerfed, that i get a little annoyed. I just have to get used to the new anvil.

Burro Boskov

Burro, how often did you get the Anvil's runes through before? Unless your opponents build their lists specifically to fight dwarfs, and therefore took no magic defense at all, I have to imagine that you were getting one per turn through, if you were lucky.

I don't know how you can say the anvil is nerfed. I consider it to be one of the more ridiculously powered things out there right now.

1) It requires no LOS. The dwarf player can stick VERY far away from the battle line, behind hills, in the middle of a forest, etc.

2) The crew is Unbreakable. No terror to chase them off, no outnumbering with fear causers, nothing. Can even have the Runelord immune to poison and KB if you spend 15 points on the right rune.

3) The crew contains a Lord-level character, with T5 no less. This means most of the usual war-machine-hunter units will get crushed if they try to get in there and melee.

4) Crew has a 4+ ward save, meaning even spells and/or artillery isn't likely to do much to it.

5) None of the effects can be stopped in any way, they just happen, and they're pretty much universally excellent. You have no idea of how annoying the magic missile is to a unit of Terradons, with their mighty ground movement rate of what, 1? 2?


Oh no, the Anvil was not nerfed, it is amazingly powerful. You can even use that Runelord as y our entire magic defense too. Give him a talisman with MRoBalance and a spellbreaker rune and you're set against just about everyone in 7th. Add a great weapon and the anti-poison/KB rune, and you've spent as much as you need to, really.

I guess i was being a bit over dramatic on how bad it was.

Like I've said, it is just a lot different, and i need ot get used to it.

Thankyou for your points on how good it is, I'll be using it again soon.

Burro Boskov