I've just bought some chaos warriors, a chariot and a hero lord, how should I base my army around these?

You have the army book first of all, right? To start off I would make sure the warriors have hand weapons and shields, just for some defense. A unit of 5 knights with Champion, Musician and Standard should be good and a unit of marauders with hand weapons and shields should do well to support your warriors in combat. I wouldn't start off to large, just get what you have painted first, then worry about expanding. Regardless you will need some solid large blocks of infantry, so your unit of warriors you may want to some how bolster to a unit of 16. I'll elt the other people leave their opinions.

Stratos

As stratos says make sure you have had a good read through the army book before you go any further. I am sure it will inspire yoou to some degree, because your first choice(s) is to decide which god and which "nationality", by which I mean Mortal, beasts or Daemons. I guess you are going for mortals with a good emphasis on Warrior style troops. As for which god that is up to you. Which ever tickles your fancy, but I wouldn't go for more then one. Perhaps undivided with a bit of one other god, but the army always looks better if its all of one God. Personally I would go for Undivided or Tzeench with a warrior based list as you can prevent your lowly LD 8 uber expensive troops panicing at the first sign of trouble.

Once you have got all this its time to expand the army. The best way to do this is choose a points value to aim at, what with you doing mortal chaos you can make that quite high, 1500 or 2000 being the optimum sizes to aim for. Then make a few army lists where you can have a good play around with all the millions of different troops you can use, especially if you want to add some daemons or Beasts to the list. Once you find one you like and what to build then buy the necesary models. You can even post your lists on this site, and people will advise you on them. Personally if I were you I would look at adding a unit of 5 or 6 Chosen Knights with the Warbanner for a really sexy unit. Then I would go for another chariot, for the unwritten rule of chariots is "2 is much better then 1". I would alsoo look at 2 units of marauder horsemen to give you some disposable and useful lighter troops. A sorcerer is a must have once you get above 1000pts even if he is for anti-magic. You will most likely find that the above ideas almost fill out a 1500pt army, which admitidly is the problem with Chaos Warrior based armies, but it makes buying the army cheap :D

Warhounds are a must in any chaos army just because they are so useful, and so cheap. There was a guy at conflict on sunday with 40 in his 1500pt list, and thats only 240pts! Other ideas include adding a few deamons to the mix. You could go for undivided furies - a great little unit, or any of the Slaaneshi deamons, because they just rock. You might also want to concider some beasty stuff, like Beast Herds, or maybe something bigger such as Ogres, Minataurs or even a Giant/Shaagoth. The possibilities really are almost endless with chaos. Oh, and don't forget to decide how much magic you want to use, whether you want to go offensive or defensive.

If you want any further help/info/support drop me an email at:

rasputinii@gmail.com

I am more then happy to help.

Cheers,

Ras

I did know you could use giants and shaggoths in a mortal army?
I thought it was only beast units like beast herds etc

Hey, i'm not complaing :P

Yes you can mix and match between beats, demons and mortal.

but if you include for example a beast herd in your mortal army they count as special and vice versa. a giant or a shaggoth would count as rare (or lord and rare in the case of a big shaggoth ^_^ ) so thats why you have lots of opportunity open to you, if you need more troops for skirmishing add some beasts or if you have beasts add some mortal warriors for punch and so on,

dan

For the time, I would reccomend staying away from Demons and Beasts until you get a good grip on the army. If I were basically starting an army from scratch, I'd start off with the following:

Get another box of warriors. This should give you 21 Warriors, plus a full command, for a soild unit of 24 warriors.

Three boxes of marauders would give you two units of 24 models with full command. You can put a hero or something in one of these units in a battle to add to their strength.

This clump of units can be mixed and matched in many different ways (smaller units for those who don't like the unit of 24 warriors). This would be a good way to start an army.

For characters, You already have a hero (hopefully that cool newer one with the two axes ;)), so you should pick up a sorcerer to add some magical stability to your army.

As mentioned before, two chariots work better than one, so I would pick up another one of these. Also, get a unit of five chaos knights. This adds some serious firepower to your army.

Finally, get some hounds. Two units of 8 hounds would be more than enough I think, and would provide some good coverage for your knights and they can also flank.


Note, this is supposed to be about a one year purchase plan. By no means did I mean for you to pick up all of this stuff at once. It is, however, a good way to get the foundation of your army up and running.

Stratos

You certainly don't want units of 24. Indeed you don't want more then 16 of any unit in the chaos army. You don't want 8 hounds to a unt either. Go for units of 5 hounds, more is just a waste. As I mentioned in my first post go with what feels right over what people say. If you want beasts/daemons go for them, if not then don't have them. Its your army after all...

Oh I know those units were too big. I meant them for versatility, thats all. I know you can go for demons and beasts and what not, I guess I failed to mention that just for the time, and simplicity's sake, mixing isn't the best move right off the start.

Stratos

I thought shaggoths and giants were only for beasts of chaos, might have too buy the army book now :),i'm thinking about doing a tzeentch army, lots of scope for conversions (nothing to do with them being kick-ass mages and fighters)
i'm only really going to be fighting high elves and lizardmen, so really I need units to beat them.

Tzeentch is a fairly good choice on both accounts then. You'll be able to match them in the magic phase fairly well if you play things right.

Two units of six hounds should provide adequate shielding from HE missle fire, and screamers are awesome for shielding your chosen knights, if you ever get around to it.

Yes, you can take Shaggoths and Giants in a mortal army, so if you feel inclined to do so, take them in your larger battles. They provide some great hitting power.

Stratos

After speaking to my friends, I have a problem - one of them has a slaan and 2 skink priests, and the other has an arch mage and a mage.
Should I get the staff of change, so I can dispel spells easily?
or go for a close combat army? and hope i can get into combat with them

You'll need magical defenses, and Tzeentch is pretty awesome with magic. Not a whole lot can stand up to a Tzeentch magic army, except for a magic heavy Lizzie list.
Staff of change is an amazing item for a Tzeentch lord, especially if he has to go up against a Slaan. It works offensively as well as defensively too, making the magic phase much more difficult for your opponent. And if you're going against elves and your guys hav mark of Tzeentch, well you should slaughter most of them in combat anyways after you thin out their ranks with magic.

I think Tzeentch sounds good for the armies you are facing.

Stratos

sorry if it seems i am going a little of topic here, but i am collecting a slannesh mortal army at the minute and was curious to whether my force would work against undead armies? what i mean by this is, through experiance who do you believe i will fair well against.

@Farsight: All armies work against all armies, but yes Slaanesh is just fine against the dead, its the immunity to psyc that helps...

@ShadowKnight: I would not advocate Tzeench ever. Its pants. The lore is rubbish, both being unpredicatable and hard to cast. However the worst problem with Tzeench is your army runs at the first sign of trouble. Any thing remotecly panicy and you are off. You would be much better running a fast Slaaneshi list against the armies you mentioned. 2 Units of Mounted Daemonettes, chariots, Knights and a Giant (to absorb magic/shooting) or fiends would be far more effective at dealing with the said armies. Magic wise do for medium magic and run four scrolls. That will stop your opponents magic for the two turns which it matters... A exalted Champ on a booby snake is always a great choice. Basically, put your points in your troops, trying to stick to 500pts of characters - I would go for an Exalted with a flail, Enchanted Shield and the Book of Secrets on a booby worm and then two sorcerers/bray shamans at lvl 2, each with two scrolls and one with slaanesh, the other with Shadows. This will give you a decent magic phase (that will really kick in in the end game) as well as a awsome magic defense. Magic heavy Lizards and Asur tend to lack troops, a disadvanatge you should capitalise on. Mounted Daemonettes being the obvious way to go. After all, its awful boring for every player in the group to play exactly the same game... I will make you a sample list tomorrow to illustrate what I am getting at.

Being immune to psychology is a huge asset against undead. There aren't really a whole lot of magic items that will make terribly short work of them. Slaaneshi spells are very deadly if used right. You can really screw over an enemy with a Vampire Count or Lord in a unit with Delectable Torture. Just make sure the majority of your units have mark of Slaanesh, and if you take a Lord of Chaos, make sure he's well supported in combat and that he's protected well. I'll post on your other thread for your army list after I get a good read.

Stratos

thank you stratos, your advise is much appreciated,

dan

Heres my 2000pt army list i'l made up, bearing in mind it is 3am.

lord

Beastlord - 290

Mark of Tzeentch
Chaos Armour
Enchanted Shield
Blade of Blood

Heroes

Wargor - 165

Battle Standard Bearer
Mark of tzeentch
Chaos Armour

Wargor - 135

Mark of Tzeentch
Great Weapon
Chaos Armour

Core

Beast Herd (x20) - 159

12 Gors, 8 Ungors(with shields)
Full Command

Beast Herd (x20) - 159

12 Gors, 8 Ungors(with shields)
Full Command

Bestigor Herd (x12) - 194

Full Command, Mark of Tzeentch

Special

Chaos Warriors (x11) - 237

Additional Hand weapons, Full command, mark of tzeentch

Chaos Chariot

Mark of Tzeentch

Chaos Trolls (x4) -220

Rare

Dragon Ogre Shaggoth - 295

plz don't be too rude :unsure:

I know it's Tzeentch, but at the same time it's beastmen, and in my opinion you don't have enough troops for this size of an army. Your heros have me thinking too. Let's see.
Beastlord. Give him a great weapon, armour of damnation, and horn of the great hunt. Horn of the Great hunt is awesome for your ambushing units.
The other two heros look ok, but at least one character should have some dispel scrolls, and someone should probably have Staff of Darkoth, another one of the Beasts best magic items.

I would say, drop the trolls and take another beast herd, and if you can afford it, a unit of warhounds. The chariot seems a bit out of place, but I'm sure you'll be able to tie it in. Make sure your Shaggoth has some protection, and you may as well give him a great weapon, as his initative isn't great anyways. The extra +2 strength is gonna cause a lot of problems for your enemy, especially with his 14(?) inch charge range.

As always, I'd like to hear some other opinions.

Stratos

The Staff of Darkroth, is only for shamans. Is there any magic tes which would be good for the wargors?

Right, I forgot that. Well in that case the Deark Heart is another useful item to add onto your beastherd's charge range.

Stratos

I was looking through the book, what are your opinions on the lore of nurgle. seems good to me

Lore of Nurgle can work very will in certain situations, but in my opinion, it lacks the fire power the Lores of Tzeentch and Slaanesh have. If you're facing High Elves with an Archmage or Lizzies with a Slann, I would suggest taking a Tzeentch general to match them. If you're really desperate to use the Lore of Nurgle, an undivided champ so you can take a tzeentch wizard and a Nurgle wizard. It's up to you.

Stratos

The thing I thought about tzeentch though, is that that are going to be in combat most of the time and won't be able to cast spells

true but do not forget that magic casters can still cast spells in combat, as long as it is not a magic missle as they require LOS to their targets.

just as a thought i would not recomend khorne armies to you as true they are effective but against a half decent army you will find they will use lots of "distraction" units to draw you out of position and then flank you with knights or something, "smash"

dont forget though with chaos to not spend too many points on charecters as soon you will run out and look at your army thinking "how many have i not got??"

still nice army list, you dont have chaos knights, good man for doing that, they are too overpriced for what you get in a unit ^_^

dan