Hey guys, it's been a while and I hope all of you are happy and successful with handling your business.

I'm still stuck in school but now I just sit around and write music for my grades. I decided to get away from orchestral stuff and toy around with some electronic music and some of my favorite tunes from my past and so... I thought you guys might enjoy what came of it.

We Find Truth in the Bliss of Sleep

In the beginning, it may not be too obvious where it's from, but this is a note for note arrangement. It has main themes and harmonies inverted, reversed, sliced up, you name it, it's in there.

I'll update it as I improve the sound quality.

See ya!

-John

Not too shabby. Keep it up.

/Galidan

So the musical mastermind still is tempted, on a rare occasion, to delve in to what this group was forced to give up so long ago...

Well, I'm quite glad I decided to take my little checkup on the forum. It has become apparent, especially recently, that this forum that once accompanied the project is truly dead. I visit usually weekly, though rarely do I actually say anything these days-- for there is no further need to.

Oh, by the way, the name alone gives away the entire theme of the song-- though I bet you're very aware of that. You are right though, it is quite hard to tell what it is near the beginning. Very nostalgic to hear something new from you-- dare I say it though, but it seems you are improving further. I loved how you progressed by building it up from beginning to end, but at the same time, I was a little disappointed that the final part of it was so short.

I wish I had something to show for the skills I have been building. *sigh...*

Well, I've said it probably a few times, but I'll say it again; the day I make something worthwhile, you guys will be informed.

apoc's right, you have gotten better, its very good, but alas, i too was disheartened by the quick ending

I think that's funny. This forum's activity haven't changed much in a year or more, and every time I visit you've posted something new.

Just thought I'd point that out.

In all friendliness though, I'm curious to see the kind of stuff you're working on Apoc. Let us know when you start showing it off.

The music master returns!

Keep it flowing man! I enjoy the memories. That theme is one of my favorites.

Well, if you are curious, I am a programmer. I've been programming ever since the beginning of this project, but I never got involved because at the time I was really just beginning to learn how to program. I also had a really busy schedule at my High School that prevented me from studying game programming at the time.

Even now I'm still a considered a beginner at game programming, but I've made some really significant progress. Unfortunately, I can only study this stuff outside of college semesters... because I'm usually too busy during them to learn anything outside of the course material. The extent of what I know at the moment is fairly basic 2D graphics. I can use sprite sheets to embed sprites (and animate them) on a background capable of scrolling (with a camera following the character). I can currently make basic special effects, and have some limited use of particle effects.

Perhaps over winter break I can make something simple... :blink:

I've been thinking of a concept of a game. For the moment, it is called "Law Breaker". It has no direct relation to breaking laws set by the government, by the way.

well at least your considered a game programmer. here i am saying im going to make a great game and such and i dont even know the basics on how to program xD its actualy quit sad :unsure:

Be sure to keep us up-to-date John. I enjoy your works.

Frankly, if you have anything NOT related to CT that you think sounds good, I don't think we'd be yelling at you if you posted it. Granted, your CT stuff is awesome, but I'm sure anything else you make is equally as good (perhaps even better).

Thanks guys! It's great to see that you guys are still around. I might post some stuff up here soon. I'm working on a demo cd right now. Anyway, keep us posted about your project Apoc. If you need any... music...

hehe

-John

I wouldn't waste your skill on anything I'm building unless I not only had an outstanding project idea, but also already had a few team members I could depend on. The offer alone is awesome, but I think the level of skill you have in your field outweighs the skill I have in my own. It'd be like Leonardo da Vinci working on some cheap Comic Book. In retrospect, I take that back-- that actually makes it sound awesome. To put it simply, I'd only even consider asking for something like that when I have no doubts in my abilities in making games-- and when I have a REALLY outstanding idea. I'll likely have the skill necessary to create simple platformers and puzzle-type games sometime over the Winter Break. I doubt I'll have the time to make something as complicated as an RPG until over the summer.

Bear in mind though, that while I say this, I'm only talking about 2D games. It will likely take a while for me to really have enough time to dedicate towards 3D game programming. At any rate, so far I have the beginnings of what I think might be a good concept. Law Breaker seems very unique in comparison to other modern games-- so if I decide on a first major project... I'm thinking that it will most likely be that.

Hmmmm... here is something I probably should have asked a while ago. What are some tools I can use to make simple music for a game, and are there any resources I can use to learn? I don't expect to ever be remotely skilled at making music, but it probably would be a good skill to have-- if I intend to make games (whether it be professionally or as a hobby).

I don't expect any outside help on my early games, but games would be pretty bland if they didn't have any tune playing in the background-- I think you guys would agree. Hence the need for me to at least know some basics for making simple tunes. Care to elaborate, anyone knowledgeable on the subject?

there are actualy programs where you can make music with mini tunes that just repeat but you can actualy make some good music with the write software. here are some examples

http://www.synapse-audio.com/orionpro.php

http://making-music.blogspot.com/2007/10/p...sed-pcfree.html

http://making-music.blogspot.com/2007/09/a...-pcprofree.html


also i would like to say in advance that the second one might be for recording actual instruments.

It depends on your background in music and what kind of tunes you're aiming to write. If you're an avid guitarist, you might have the best results getting a decent microphone and a simple multi-tracking program like Adobe Audition. If you have some knowledge in notating music, then your best bet might be with simple all-in-one sequencing programs like Fruity Loops or Propellerhead's Reason. And so on.

Then there's question about genre. If you're going to make electronic music, then you have a few options: Fruity Loops, Reason, hardware (real keyboards and sound modules), or powerful virtual instruments within a host sequencer. If you just adore orchestral scores as much as I do, there are also quite a few viable options. Though orchestral music tends to be "harder" to write and programs of good quality are very taxing on your system (unless you have a 80 piece orchestra hanging out in your basement). If that's your thing, then you might want to look into East West Quantum Leap Symphonic Orchestra (the silver or gold versions). And then there's live acoustic instruments, drums, etc. etc.

Also, it never hurts to know some music theory. Some people are against using any kind of rules or guidelines in music so don't think that theory is a must. Personally, however, theory lets me write music faster and hold onto ideas that I might get while I'm brushing my teeth or something.

So tell me a little bit more about your musical endeavors and where you want to take them. I will try to help you get off the ground.

-John

I call those people stupid.

/Galidan

lmao.

All I know is I blow into one end, and sound comes out the other. lol. Theres no way I can write music. I learn best by hearing rather than reading sheet. I imagine its works in reverse for me too.


You guys are lucky to be even a little musically gifted.

Finally! Some time to reply! I've been freakishly busy with my college classes of late... sorry about the delay in my response.

Lets see... a few people mentioned some software that I can use. That's great. Definitely useful to know of some software that I can use-- but I think I need to go a step further.

John, I'd love to say I have prior musical skill. Unfortunately, I don't. Unless you count that recorder I was forced to play during Middle School, or the few times I tried out drums, I have little or no experience. Right now, I can see you rolling your eyes about the prospect of me suddenly being capable of doing these things. Right now it is not my intent to create an original song. Right now my goal is to learn the fundamentals of how music is written. Then I intend to take the necessary steps needed to make a "copy" of some random game music using one of the programs that were mentioned. Then I intend to make my own rendition of a particular song. Only if I feel extremely confident would I bother actually making something completely original. Quite frankly, I may never actually get to that point.

My goal here is to just be capable of making music for some of my "solo games' (simple games that I develop completely alone). They don't need to be anything fancy, just some tunes to make things less dull than complete silence. If I don't have the ability to make at least basic music, a lot of the early games I make will be kind of... well... colorless and emotionless voids of games. I think you and the others around here would agree. Hence I need to have at least basic skill in the subject-- if I intend to start developing some simple games soon.


Essentially, this is what I absolutely need to know to get started-- I need to have some sort of reference to use that covers the basics, and I also need a recommendation for which software I should use first. I've heard Fruity Loops is pretty good for beginners... but I don't know all that much about the subject in general, so does anyone have any alternate suggestions?

Appreciating music is enough experience to write music. But if you want to understand how music is pieced together, I would strongly recommend getting some theory under your belt. Of course, this is just my opinion, your mileage may vary.

I think you should look into picking up a well organized book on music theory. Once you get an understanding of notation, scales, and chords, you will start to see the form and structure of the music you listen to. Then, if you want to take it a step further, you can get into some more advanced theory like chromatic harmony, jazz chords, and modulations. Sight singing, ear training, and orchestration are a few things that I would also recommend you look into even if it's just for a tiny bit.

So I'm rambling. But back to what you want to do. You said that you want to recreate music from other games. There are a few options, yet again... you can take midi files from the net and plug them into your software, you can download or buy sheet music, or the best choice would be to do some old fashioned transcriptions (which to me, sounds like what you want to do). Of course this means that you'll either have to have access to an instrument in order to figure out the notes or develop a decent sense of pitch. I think transcribing music is one of the best methods of improving your musicianship. I started off with far less experience than you, but I learned what I like to consider a good deal by transcribing a lot of music. Some of my old CTRP material came from the transcription assignments that I gave to myself.

So I think that would be a good starting point. It's great that you want to study the music of others first. It'll prevent you from making the really horrendous mistakes that I've made. Actually, I still make a lot of the same mistakes while simultaneously inventing new ones. I don't learn from them, but I hope that you can. As for software, it really depends on the style of music. Unless you're going for ultra-realistic orchestral mock-ups, most of the software out there will most likely fit your needs.

A lot of people scoff at Fruity Loops since it's been branded as an entry level product. However, I'd like to stress that I've heard both fantastic and... well, not so fantastic music produced with all sorts of music producing software (including FL). It's really about your techniques in composition, sequencing, and mastering that will make your music shine.

So good luck! And I'll always check back for any questions, granted that it's within my capabilities to provide answers. If you need any help with basic theory, message me on AIM or better yet, MSN.

-John

Yeah... I think I'm pretty much agreeing with you on that John. It isn't particularly easy to do anything without knowing the theory behind WHY it works. Hence it seems to me that I should definitely study music theory. I can't imagine writing or comprehending how it is put together otherwise. I don't have much time to devote at the moment... until at least the Winter Break. For now though, I think I'll look up Fruity Loops and perhaps some simple references on music theory. I don't have a lot of time, but perhaps I can squeeze in a few "experiments". We'll see how that goes... :blink:

On a random note... I've never really thought about using an actual instrument. I can see what you mean though-- as it'd doubtlessly be easier to see how something sounds with an actual instrument than playing with software. Ironically... both of my sisters have instruments. One has a guitar... while the other has a violin. I wonder if they'd let me try them... :unsure:

Theory is always needed in the use of practicality. Without it we would be no where. Math, science, physics, music, writing; all would have gone nowhere without theory to propel them.




Ya, theres my rant. :P

i can understand if you were playin a gatuir and try to explain it as strings being strum and the rest of that. but what about somthing like an elelctric piano you cant exactly say that their are circuts connecting to each key to make a sound and automaticly understand how to play :lol: