As a citizen growing increasingly concerned, I cannot help but speak up and voice my opinion on the current state of affairs.

With the New Year, the members of this region elected to cabinet, Old Ogastein, a first time cabinet member, 420_Celebrants, a veteran of regional affairs, who has absorbed enormous responsibility with resounding success, and Omnivorous who has always shown himself readily available for action. These three honourable members would be joining Carbanousa in cabinet, who is one of the longest serving forum admins in the history of NationStates and a keystone to our regional history.

With a cabinet composed of such highly credentialed members, what can we observe?

On the positive side, we find that the MoDB has been an interesting and active place, with the newly created Open Office, the MoDB Report, and the continuity of Canadiana. 420 has been Johnny on the spot with issues such as the recent spam-bots and tackling some of the forums issues created by the server crash. Foreign Affairs are in good shape as efforts have been made to update threads that were affected by the server crash and our foreign policy commitments have been sustained. Carbanousa has also never failed in his duty to update the votes on UN resolutions.

On the negative side, we find several objective facts that just cannot stand, for the sake of this region and it’s future.

Today is the 27th of January and we find that cabinet is still missing a Minister of Defence and three Deputy Ministers. It is totally unacceptable, in my opinion, that one-third of a term should pass while a cabinet still fields an incomplete roster. Another problem is that discussions that were being advanced by some of our region’s members in the House of Commons, on a couple of issues, has been stifled and delayed because of Cabinet’s deficit in numbers. I for one have held back from contributing out of courtesy, because of the shortage in cabinet.

Despite all of these failures, Cabinet has still somehow found the time to apply an unjust warning to Jack Tarr, when he did absolutely nothing wrong.

We also find that the DoI has been, at least visibly, dormant this term, in large part because of a very unfortunate computer mishap that has affected Hamsters. Her absence has been felt and I’m sure we can all agree together that we’d love to have her back. It is still a gloomy reality though that after one third of a term we have very little recruitment activity going on.

Canada as a founder-less region, unlike founder regions who are invulnerable to attacks, has an indigenous responsibility in a NationStates of rapidly declining populations everywhere, to ensure our regional safety and future, by having the regional immigration department recruiting as often as possible. This increases my conviction that Immigration and our region’s interest, would best be served with a Ministry of Immigration, rather than a department.

If Hamsters had been deservedly elected as MoI, her appointed deputy would have been able in this case, to carry the workload in her absence.

These are all critical problems that must be tackled with some degree of assertiveness. I as a mere member of Canada, observing from my viewpoint, I’m inclined to say that this has very likely been the most sluggish start to any term on record in Canada.

It is also true that Cabinet has taken some very harsh criticism lately, speaking on my behalf, not all of it has been justified and fair, because after all we have no idea what cabinet members have been up to. But nevertheless, they should be taken as wakeup calls from the regional members they represent.

It’s likely that cabinet might be thinking right now, that the region has suddenly made a point of making their daily forum experience a living hell. But that just isn’t the case. In every crisis there is tragedy and opportunity. I’m ready to help in any way I can and I’m sure everyone else in the region is too.

Right ... we're three members short already and you think that making the DoI into a Ministry would help things??

That would leave me without a Deputy and who knows if the MoI would be able to find a Deputy either.

Pretty backwards thinking.

As for Jack Tarr ... c'mon ... he incited a post that was YELLING for trouble to be brought. He's incited incidents before and has escaped any actions against him because of his long time status and his well known penchant for being a member who skirts the lines and tries to get away with more than the PG rules should allow for.

Why the heck isn't a warning warranted for asking for the type of picture he asked for. Would Demietricus have earned a bar of warning had the request not been there in the first place? Sure, a better image could have been chosen, but the request was skirting the issue in the first place.

You seem to be perfectly fine with Demietricus taking on a bar of warning, but are sticking up for the instigator?

Again ... pretty backwards thinking.

As for the DoI being disabled ... I personally asked for it.

Why? BECAUSE WE'RE SCREWED.

Our Region is run on this forum. This forum is FUBAR'D. Why would we want to invite new people to a half-assed effort? I simply requested that initiatives be scaled back a bit to reflect what we have to offer. I posted for a new initiative for DoI members to participate in to keep the Department active, but NO ONE VOLUNTEERED.

So ... what, exactly, is your magical way to get people to suddenly get involved? You want us to just mandate someone to do a job? That isn't very democratic to me.

If you want more backwards thinking, take this one on for size - your actions and lack of respect for the Cabinet, which is under duress enough as it is, has made me not care anymore to carry on the job.

I think I might just be done, good and for all.

Thanks :)

So, you quit and it's all C6's fault?

As a member of the DoI, I recruit lots when I have free time. A couple of weekends ago I sent invitations out to over 300 new nations over that Fri-Sat-Sun from the Feeders I'm responsible for recruiting from. Do you want to know how many of those nations are in Canada? NOT ONE. Do you know how long it took to send those messages and do you wonder why some people are lacking enthusiasm for stabilising the region's population?
I've accepted that we probably won't be able to reach anywhere near the heights of 350+ nations we had a couple of months ago.


The DoI is a MoRA initiative. Having a Seventh Ministry is an appauling idea considering that only 3 out of the 5 Ministries last election had any applications.

Like Omni I spend my Saturday and Sunday mornings drinking coffee in bed and recruiting, trying to hold 300 is a major challenge at this time. I have been doing this for a long time now, before MoI was even created, and I will continue to do so.

Lets face it NationStates is dying out, it's old school, CyberNations took over and is on an upward climb.
Scanning NS regions right now. the most I can find online, on a NS forum, is 3 people in The West Pacific. The least I can find right now on a CN alliance forum is 17 people. The CN main forum right now = 93 guests, 130 members, 2 anonymous members. Maybe we need to go there to recruit. ;)
Now add in the numerous amount other games out there that are more challenging.

In NS prime Feeders used to house over 8,000 nations with ease right now they are housing around 4.5 thousand. Many regions that were very active in the past have closed up do to inactivity. Personally at 300 nations I think Canada is doing great. As an ambassador I have had other regions question how we are hanging onto such a high regional count.

If we can't fill the positions we have now, how do you expect us to fill another minister position and create a judicial branch? We can't just pull people out of our hats.

Right now due to RL I can't give my all, like I have in the past, but believe me I have been and will continue to give what I can to Canada.

I love this place! :wub:

(:fonz:)


Amazingly, this week is the first time the population of the World has increased (by 700-odd nations) since well before the Server crash.

I don't quite see me saying that I quit.

You are one to take things a little too seriously for the claims of your smoking habits. Re-freaking-lax girl.

If I do decide to quit, which is looking more and more likey under the circumstances, it will be simply because I want to go back to the simple days of just being a member, where nothing disasterous happens and dealing with out-of-line behaviour isn't a daily issue.

I think some of you ex-cabinet members have forgotten what it's like to have to deal with all of the Cabinet duties, AS WELL as dealing with fixing the forum, AS WELL as having a brand new Minister that needs the ropes taught to them, AS WELL as not having a full Cabinet, AS WELL as having real life issues to deal with.

It isn't fun to have people rant and rave at you day after day about the same stuff. One starts to just wish for relaxation and less stress.

And Canada6's words, as well as some other members, including you Ess, are making me want that a lot sooner.

Literally ... chill out and let us do what we have to do. Nothing is going to get solved if we aren't given a chance to get things rolling.

It would help immensely if Carbanousa wasn't having issues getting onto the forum without recieving a 404 error, as I just found out, as do you all now.

As things stand you are currently without an active deputy anyway.

I've gone on record before defending that MoDB should be a regional department instead of a ministry, so that the number of nations necessary, isn't a factor in what I've suggested. It's a question of setting priorities. The logic here is that by giving immigration a ministerial priority it can eventually solve the problem of inactivity.

In repsonse to Omni, I've never once called for a 7th ministry.

I disagree with this. I think we should be putting the dispute resolution to the test and see if it might apply to this case. This incident sheds light on the fact that Canada needs an independent judiciary. There are many ways we can set something like that up. It can consist of one, two or three nations that might not even be very active, but need only to show up sporadically to give jurisdiction and allow arguments and counter-arguments to be presented orderly.

Actually I had no idea Demietricus had been issued a warning prior to this morning. Demietricus posted a pornographic picture and deserved the stiff warning. JT did nothing wrong in my opinion.

I don't have access to any of that. I would have definitely volunteered. I've been politely waiting for to see some initiative from the DoI, until I finally asked what was up a few days ago. I've always sporadically recruited in The Pacific from time to time, out of my emotional antipathy against The Pacific's current despotic government.

In any event, I remember the good old days when things like, shutting down departments and such were disclosed and announced. So far this term you've made no public appeals for the cause of immigration. I don't blame you, as I know full well what being a MoRA is like. I blame the system. MoI should be it's own ministry. In my opinion it is that important and deserves that much attention.

I'm not sure what job you are specifically referring to, but as ministers, it is part of the constitutional profile of duties to appoint Deputies. It is also the PM's responsibility to fill vacancies in cabinet. So in answer to your question: Yes, cabinet should mandate nations to do a job. The constitution says so.


I think I've been fair in my assessment and I've expressed my sympathy several times with the cabinet's duties. I'd just wish that cabinet would be more open in letting the region help out instead of having cabinet members asking us regional members to sit back stand idle. I share Parrrrtay's positive view of the region and it's members. So far the only public request for help that hasn't been responded to my knowledge is Red's appeal for volunteers for DMoJ. We've had applications for ambassadors and volunteers for the MoD. We're still here and here to help in any way we can. By making critical comments or responding to the cabinet's calls.

Hammy is overall responsible for the DoI - she couldn't appeal for help if she was on holiday or without a computer. The number of nations is still a factor, it doesn't matter how many Ministries there are, we don't have enough members who are at the moment committed to running the region. People would still be needed to run the "Department of Doughuts and Beer" even if it wasn't a Ministry. I support it as a Ministry as without it, there would be

That would be because he didn't appeal and some member of the region attacked Cabinet's decision before our decision could be fully explained or even completed.

If you are so inspired and concerned about the long time it has taken why didn't you ask Carb directly what was happening a long time ago? If there are no takers for the jobs, who are we going to appoint? Ess and Shay said they would check up endorsements, not that they would become MoDs or Deputies.
Red appealed for a Deputy. Have you seen any? It's not that we haven't tried, it's that none of you have taken the bait (I'm not putting blame on any of you, just you're the people who generally fill the positions of Deputyship, being members of the region and all and that we don't tend to appoint people from outside the region.) We can't make pottery if we have no clay or turning wheel. People have been asked and we've asked people about other people and we've received negatives at every door we knocked at.

Hence why immigration should be the first priority.

But still I think we still have active members here that are ready to help.

I don't. I'm a huge fan of the DB but I don't think it should be a ministry in detriment of immigration. That's what we currently have.

Because I had faith in Carb and cabinet, that the position of MoD was going to be imminently filled at a moment's notice.

That's not what I've been told by Ess.

Even if what you are saying here is true, that there are no active members of this board that have not yet been asked to step up for a position, Parrrrtay has already very well pointed out, the PM has not exhausted his options yet. He can call for a snap-election.

Only because I'm no expert on IP search and I don't know how to run a script. I am however willing to learn.
If you had posted an emergency election as stated in the Constitution I would of ran for the position and you can bet your bottom dollar Ess would of backed me and helped by becoming my deputy. Yes my time is limited but I feel MoD is an important position and needs to be filled ASAP. By whoever is willing to give what they can.

I have no argument with that statement. However, the TOS also takes a hard stand on drugs and while I totally disagree with the fact. Pot is illegal yet it is part of 420's signature. I guess given the logic I have seen so far, I suppose I could report that every post 420 makes is in violation of the Invision TOS just because of that signature. I however will not stoop to what I consider is the level of absurdity that has caused all of this.

I cannot remember a time when I was not offended by 4 20's constant, chronic references to illegal drugs. However, I have never made a comment to him, or anyone else about it because it is his business. But given the shift in the culture here, I certainly believe that this is something that needs to be addressed because I know it is offensive to me, and I dare say that it is offensive to some others here as well.....

papa spent three weeks advertising for the TSP within the region. he had nobody turn up to the TSP forum as well.

it's a NS problem, not just a cwanada problem.

You edited your original post. You initially said you were done, not might be done. That's what Ess was replying to (as you well know).

Thanks, Bs.

To 420:

See above.

I smoke pot, so what? I don't have it in my sig and I rarely talk about it, but now you of all people want to talk to me about smoking weed?? What a joke! Your whole schtick is being a pothead. Quite the claim to fame. :rolleyes:

Don't ever tell me to relax, boy.

You poor baby! So hard done by! I bet you're the hardest working person *ever* on this board - NOT! Again - I *did* apply for the job of MoD. Cabinet would be less "stressed" if I had gotten it from Carb as Red got his position.

"Ranting and raving?" Your are the drama queen, aren't you?! Answer our questions and we won't feel the need to keep "ranting".

How long do y'all need?

And - for the record - (again) I volunteered for the MoD job - the whole thing! - when there were still 2 positions open. Red got one position pretty quick, but both Shay and I have been snubbed for the MoD job.

Who did you personally ask for permission to close down the DoI? Not the members. It's in the Constitution you can't just turn it off.

As a Member of DoI why wasn't I informed of it's closing down completely?
Where did you post for a new initiative for DoI members to participate in to keep the Department active?
Where did you inform the region that it was shut down completely?
I just see a locked thread and no new posts there.
Believe me I have been watching it to see if anything will be done.

See and here is where I don't really understand what is going on. Carb told me not long ago that Ess would have been appointed long ago if she had volunteered.

Now what I'm incredibly curious about here, is not if Ess volunteered for the MoD or not, and not if Carb received the invitation or not. What really captures my curiosity here, is why on earth didn't Carb ask Ess if she wanted the job, when he thinks so highly of her.

And what gives Cabinet the right to ALL take over the MoD's job?

Once again, from note in the region Ess and Shay volunteered to keep count of endo checks, not to be MoDs. If either of you did ask Carb to be MoD at any stage, that would be something you will need to take up with him as he'd know exactly what happened; currently and previously, both of you were put down on record to be too engaged in RL.

As for the empty position, a Special Election called by the PM was going to go up by Carb hasn't had access to the forum and so it hasn't.

As most of you are probably aware, this is the first time I have been able to get online in nearly a month and I have a few days' of reading to do (if not more) before I'm completely up to speed. But I would like to state that I have had no access to the DoI at all this year, in fact since the elections were called. This was of course blamed on the forum crash affecting my permissions, which may or may not be true, but it is only due to C6's intervention that now I am able to see the DoI again.

I'm not exactly sure what happened either, but I'm glad it's taken care of. Welcome back. :)

We missed you soooo much!!

Wtg, C6. :D

*Peeks around the corner and sees a face from the not so distant past. Grins from ear to ear as he thinks to himself. PARTY
Sneaks out the door and heads downtown.*

*Follows JT's Car*