Ok, I may go on a rant right now. As I do when Ben or Alec is involved.

While he was completely unhinged I couldn't help but feel sorry for him. Of course, killing/murder is wrong and nothing can excuse that. Ben's case, I feel, is different.

Personally I think it was a mixture of a couple of things. Reason number one; Ben was created to be a soldier, to hunt and to kill. He grew up with the idea of having to be the 'perfect' soldier. What hope did he have?

Reason number two, from where I was it looked as though Ben never grew up mentally. It was like he was a 12 year old boy trapped in the body of a 19/20 year old man. I get that Max turned out fine and the others, but I feel Ben's imagination may have gotten the better of him and caused his brain not to mature.

(Gah, I sound so dumb)

Another reason, his blinding faith in the Blue Lady. He was so obsessed with her that he couldn't take it when someone told him otherwise. My opinion, she was something that soothed his fears? Kept him 'safe' in a way. I don't know.

The end, it breaks my heart to watch it. It's like he comes good at the very end, because he knows he's safe and Manticore can't hurt him. :(

Anyway, I'll stop because reading back over that it makes no sense.. but yeah.

Oh! YES! *snugs Ash*

I swear, you and I are twins or something! I really, realllllyyy felt sorry for him. It was like he couldn't help it, because of what they made him, and all his fears.

Perhaps his brain wasn't maturing, maybe, but other than that, I just see that scared little boy just trying to do right and failing. His blind obedience to the 'Blue Lady' was what pushed him to kill. He didn't know any better...

:unsure: I'm sure *I* made no sense there...

YES YES YES!

Exactly what I was trying to say with the maturing thing..

It seemed like that to me. That he was a boy doing what he 'believed' was right and was failing at it. He really didn't know any better.

My next point..

Would Ben have been 'normal' if he had of stayed with one of the others?

Oooh. Thats a good question.

I'm not sure... I mean, maybe they would have been able to catch the whole 'Blue Lady' thing earlier, and nip it in the butt, like, as he grew up gone, 'Dude, really...' like an imaginary friend or something... but, I don't know.

Hmm... maybe no? I'm thinking that it might have just been something in him that was a bit off. That maybe, he had the same DNA as 'Golden Boy' but something happened to him that changed that? Things can change a person's phenotype and occasionally genotype, like a mutation, through lifestyle choices... *shrug* Maybe something he did, maybe just after, or during the escape, caused him to be a bit messed up in the head?

Wow, that probably made no sense. I'm not sure that lifestyle choices can change genotypes and phenotypes enough to make someone a bit screwed up, even just a little...

Not that he was... but he was... right? I mean, he was so DAMAGED.

Ok stop me if this doesn't make any sense....


They are genetically engineered, true. Everything in them was put there by a scientist. Max's unit had a few kids with the whole seizure dealio. Maybe, caused by a little too much something in their cocktail or the 'wires' in the brain were 'crossed' or 'loose'. My opinion, I don't actually remember if that was touched on in the show.

How does this relate to the mental thing? I'm thinking Ben had a little too much of something in his cocktail or he had a few more extras that his brain couldn't handle.

uh, I think I need to stop. ahaha

Oh, no, don't stop, I totally get it!

They did touch on that in the show, how some of their brain's 'wiring' was screwed up, and they needed more tryptophan, to stop the seizures...

So, maybe you're right... Lydecker did say at one point - none of the others had displayed symptoms of his behaviour.

So perhaps his brain just had a little more of something, or less, as the whole tryptophan thing worked out.

Mind you, how would that explain how well Alec worked out? *g*

heh, Ben looked perfect.

*shakes head*

Do you think maybe Lydecker was watching Ben to see if he went weird while he was at Manticore? Like they knew he was a little different?

Ooooh. Now that would change things, wouldn't it!?

And then when they got out, it would have been like, DOUBLE CRAP.

I'm not sure... I get the feeling that somehow, they would have put more emphasis on finding them, if that was the case.

True.

hehe I'm not alone! :lol:

Never! We are a freak NATION. :)

Not to mention that you're just generally YAY. :lol:

Hmm...

So, do you think that Alec could have ever changed, if we had seen more of him, as in, later? I mean, he may have eventually started to act a bit different (NOOOO!) at the very least?

Honestly, I've read only one fic about Alec going whack. I personally don't think so. But he is Ben's clone, so maybe.

hmm...

Well thats where i was getting it from, the whole clone thing.

random unrelated comment: in my previous post I nearly said Dean's clone.

:lol:

Yeah, but maybe primarily Alec was a clone, looks and various other things. But they do have fairly different personalities. So, maybe Alec was made a little different?

lol @ you.

Hmmm...

True, they have different personalities... maybe.

Uh... Just because they were made clones or maybe born as twins (don't know where I saw that theory), but the lack of the same enviroment will make them different. Alec had both different upbringing, more purpose as Ben said that after they ran from Manticore he got lost (everything made sense to him there) and Alec's different perception of things. He was obviously more stronger character and more balanced just because he had guidence. They might have kept a closer eye on him. He wouldn't have survived the Psy ops if he wasn't stronger. Though, I think that Alec is actually more adaptable as an indivudual than all the rest. He could have ran with Max and others and yet stay sane.

Did this made any sense???? Swear to God, to me didn't....

why do you think that?

Just look how fast he adopted to Max's world. True, he came looking for her to get a job and he knew that he needed somebody who went through the introduction to the world. But he suprinsigly fast made friends with both Sketchy and Normal (partially beacuse Normal is infatuaded with him...) and even OC. I mean, he was an asshole, so to speak, since he had no moral values and no sense of what is right or wrong, but the episode where he firts gets Sketchy in trouble then gets him out, just made me see how fast he adapts toa situation and learns. And he know exactly how to act around some people and what to say. Quick and witty... That time when Normal wanted Alec and Sketchy to deliver one more package, Alec quickly got an idea to bring Normal with them so they wouldn't have to work...

A bit manipulative, quick thinking and good improvisation. Manticore traits... And he used that Common language really good even if he didn't really move around people who were his age to properly learn the use of the language...

I hope this is helpfull and explanatory....

Hmmm...

Well said... *strokes imaginary beard*

Uh, okay.... Awesome!!!! ;)

Okay, so, I was watching Pollo Loco the other night, (*glee*) and a thought struck me.

We see the little boy, but moreso towards his end... whereas in the rest of it, he KNEW it was wrong, and he was asking people to stop him, knowing that they couldn't. Perhaps he was playing them, and didn't really 'know', just knew that they thought it and he could use that, but other than that, he knew that they couldn't stop him...

Which is just a summary really, eh? Haha. I suck at this. Anyway...

So, he knows what he is doing is wrong, but, he just seemed to love what he was... he was a true soldier, perhaps with less of that 'independent' characteristic that his unit had, so when he left, he remained the soldier, and lost his way.
He concentrated a lot on what they were 'meant to be', and how they should never have left... when Father Destry spoke of soldiers, he jumped on the opportunity -

I'm a soldier!

he really wanted to get the point across, as I see it. And the way he was 'confessing' once again, could be either actual guilt, because he knows he's wrong and messed up, or that 'wrong and messed up' part of him playing on people's emotions and society ideas.

I don't know...

I'm at school at the moment, so thats probably gibberish... everything around me is loud and annoying and yeah...

Hope that made sense. I'm just trying to pinpoint Ben, and how he really was... maybe we'll never know.

Reading back over that all these hours later... it makes little to no sense. Right?