Maybe it's just me thinking this, but while I was signing up and getting everything ready for registration, I had a hellish time trying to find everything in it's proper place within the rulebook, which seems to have started out as a neat set of rules, then had several topics half hazardously strewn in and pinned. In other words, it is an absolute mess. There are three topics related to dueling strewn about and I've no doubt missed something important because I couldn't find it or something.

So, lets sum this up. My suggestion?

Clean up the rules and organize them properly, preferably in sections related to certain things, rather than tossing them around in random places and forcing the new users to try and navigate every little thing then rip their hair out in frustration (As I did.) I'm not asking for a complete over haul of the rules, just maybe rearrange them and merge some topics related to each other or something.

I definitely had a similar experience when I joined, though after a while I sorta got used to things (or I ignored them, like dueling and the pawn shop x.x), and therefore forgot what the problem was - Which things were hard to find - etc.

Dueling especially.

I think Kiwi is probably the only one that knows every rule about dueling x3;. It's extremely hard to fight someone when you don't know what your moves are supposed to be accomplishing OOC. Damage-wise and above. Tactics are challenging with limited information. I think that happened because people want to be creative (*raises hand*) and don't want an intricate rules system governing how they fight or what decisions are best.

Not much to answer here, but I hope I reemphasized your point for some overhaulage :P. Also, gratz on speaking up so early in the game :3. Not a shy one here x3 *pokes*.

Eheheh....Is that a good or bad thing? o_O

Anyways, I wasn't afraid to speak up about it because when I first arrived at the board, I thought "Ah, this is a bit plain. No skin, but nice banner". Then I checked the rules, but my first reaction was "DEAR GOD THE CONFUSION!"

Sooooo....Yeah.

Messy Rules > My Sanity

Also, has no one thought of just making the rules visible from the root page on the Administration instead of having to click into an area THEN go into the rules? Then while you're at it, have someone (Hell, I'd be willing to do it) create a character template and explain things about first registering in there, rather than making the new user run around all the random rules in frustration.

Hey, did you try reading the Ultimate FAQ? I remember things being kind of confusing and messy back when I joined (this is my second account, I'm just too lazy to log out. ^^;; I've actually been here about 4 and a half years). However, the FAQ was supposed to take all the different informative posts from the "Rule Book" and condense them in an easy-to-understand form for new players. If that didn't help you in some things, it would be good to know the specific things so that the FAQ can be amended and better fulfill it's purpose. :3

Yeah, on Gear's point, I think there is a character template full in either the Ultimate FAQ or NISDIP, which are really our big set of rules, I think.

Really, if it's not in the Ultimate FAQ (Pawn Shop and Duelling are skimmed over in it) I don't really bother with it. If I was going to specifically do something, I'd look it up, but even then, I think the Ultimate FAQ covers it.

Anything else (if you want really detailed instruction) is filed away in NISDIP I find.

Post-Registration, there really aren't that many rules, other than basic RPing stuff, that need to be obeyed (involving powerplaying and all that nice stuff). There's even a little summary of .hack// for those who don't know the series, so that things stay at least mildly canon.

If anything, I'd say that maybe NISDIP and the FAQ are difficult for people new to the site to find? Or maybe it's these guides specifically that you find messy, but that's my input. Hopefully it wasn't... useless? lol

I think Blazewind did try the Ultimate FAQ, but it has long been my contention that the Ultimate FAQ is not only incomplete, but needs to be rewritten. Phoenix did a good job when he first wrote it, and for now it's a hell of a lot better than nothing, but I've got a project in the works that will correct the problem. Granted, I've been sitting on it for a couple months now and haven't made a whole lot of progress, but now that I'm done with school for the summer I should have enough time to put a dent in it (I've had the project outlined for the past two or three years, and I'm only now closing on about a third of the way done--namely because working on it has been rather boring).

You raise a legitimate point, though. If you have any questions about anything, don't hesitate to contact one of us moderator types. We generally know what we're doing, and I promise none of us bite (anymore)!

Yeah, I think part of the problem is finding the FAQ/NISDIP (even though they are linked to in numerous locations) since there are....twenty (I just counted!) things pinned in the rulebook. Consolidation would probably be good. 'BEFORE YOU POST REGISTRATION...' and 'Registration, you must read this!' seem particularly redundant, considering the ultimate FAQ. (And it's a bit odd that there's another thread referred to as the FAQ, with the 'Ultimate FAQ' actually being called the 'Ultimate Divergence Guide'.) And there certainly is a lot of scattered dueling info.

Your new project sounds like it'll be mega helpful, Jpec. Would it include everything in the guide plus dueling stuff too?

Let me put it this way:

As it is, I already put all those threads into one place when they'd previously been scattered in numerous places throughout the board; deleted over a dozen now-obsolete threads; consolidated several others; updated several sections of the Ultimate FAQ; updated the Registration form and information; and fixed the errors I made when initially writing the Dueling FAQ.

All of this was some time last summer (whenever the Rule Book was initially created...) My efforts were then trampled on by a combination of having to go back to 60+ hour work weeks, and the fact that one person can/should not rewrite the rules all on their own.

tldr new player version; the rules are way more organized than they used to be, sorry if they're still not clear enough, that's what happens when 20 people write the rules initially, ask your questions and I shall fix.

tldr old player version; T_T if you think it needs fixed, say something, or better yet, help me out here. I've lost half my staff in the last year and been mostly too busy to do anything myself, y'know?

Well, I'm trying to create a new user specific guide at the moment, including pre-formatted template, so hopefully that'll do some good in the future. If someone helps me (Staff, this definitely means you), I'm working to merge some topics myself, which I'll post up to be pinned or something.

Give me a week, and I'll have a posted version of what you're talking about. And while I appreciate your eagerness to get this done, things move quite a bit slower than that around here.

Thank you, Dien. Forgive my snappiness overall; it's just that this seems to get brought up each summer (when school lets out and new people start to drift in...) and progress on actually fixing it never seems to pass 20%... @.@ But this time around, I'd really like to get it done.

No offense or anything, but if you need help because "I've lost half my staff in the last year and been mostly too busy to do anything myself...", why not take it when someone offers? In my opinion, it's not always a good thing that "things move quite a bit slower than that around here", especially when someone is so eager to help.

I was going to offer my help too if there was a need, but it seems like, despite complaining of a lack of help, you don't want any.

I don't believe it's so much that Dien or Lyra don't want your help, but they also need to make sure to look over every little thing long the way to make sure that it's correct and is completely up-to-date with whatever changes have been made.

() To be honest? It's because I haven't been around often enough to see people offer help. Until school let out four weeks ago, I was lucky if I logged on once a week. And there's also the fact that most the people who offer to help.. turn around and flop on me three days later. I lean towards having older members help me, partially because they're more familiar with the rules and partially because I myself am more familiar with them and have an easier time trusting them to do their work (a theory that doesn't always hold through, of course...).

I do find it a little rude that you accuse me of not wanting help when, to my knowledge, I've said nothing to indicate otherwise - other than, perhaps, be a little less quick to accept it than I should. Actually, I've outright said in this thread that I need some help and that I don't always know where things need fixing. I'm not a god about this stuff like Rayo was, I'm just she who happened to inherit the site from he who inherited the site, so I'm just doing the best I can all things considered. If you think something needs fixed, tell me, tell Centrus, whatever, just speak up. If you have the time and the will, volunteer, if you don't, just make suggestions.

And as for the slow speed of the site as a whole? To some extent, it definitely sucks and it's been pissing me off when things take months at a time. On the other, at least 3/4 of the members have full time college and/or jobs to worry about, and so returning to an "everything gets done in under 48 hours" mindset like the site had 3+ years ago is improbable and honestly would not be fair to the members who have devoted years of time to this site and do not have the time to be on more than a couple nights a week. Yes, it's absurd if/when quests take weeks to be graded. No, they shouldn't be done an hour later either, especially if they couldn't even be read in that time, and especially considering the grading mods are likely at work a good eight hours of the day.

I desperately want to get the site back in working order - I have wanted to for months and want to even more after Divvy-con. But everyone talks big then doesn't actually stand up and walk when action needs to be taken. We're either in this together or we're not in at all.

I don't think Damek was accusing the site of being slow-moving; we're both college students too and devote what time we can, which isn't always a lot. It was just perplexing to see someone offer speedy help and get turned down, especially when they said they had already started doing it. (So it wasn't like an offer of help that would later flop.)

Dieny-poo likes to do things his own way. He's shot me down several times as well!

I know that I'm hardly one to speak of speed, especially when everything's already been said, but I must say it. If you think I'm lagging on anything, confront me about it. For the love of God, confront me about it. I'll be straight with ya and tell you what's going on. When I am given something to do here, I put it as far up the priority list as I can [Lord knows sleep tends to fall pretty low on there. xD]. I really do appreciate all the patience that has been afforded to me in the last year I've been an Admin, but don't give me too much! xP

That said, I agree that the need for clarification of things needs to be done. Lyra, Zan and I all made changes to the Ultimate Guide, and I think our readiness to modify that in place of overhauling and making a new guide caught us a bit...unaware to the difficulty that some of the newer players are facing. I'll be sure to work closely with Dien [even if he doesn't want it xP] to ensure that everything is included. If any new players are having specific troubles, talk to me! I'll make sure that it gets included in the guide as well as help you with the issue.

If there is anything that is important to our community here, it is the ability to have fun. If we get too bogged down in the difficulties, then it is inevitable for the fun to vanish from our beautiful site. If that's gone, why are we all here? That's something I'd rather not have to think about!

Thank you all for being the strong minded folks you are, and bringing this to our attention, in addition to offering the hand of help that you have. I hope that the time soon comes where you can aid us in our mission to make this a better community for all.

CENT EDIT: See, all you have to do is harass Dien, then he gets right on it. xD
DIEN EDIT: Yeah, but then I invade your personal space with an edit and LINKAGE. Patronize me not, captain!

Props to Dien on the awesome progess so far on the guide. =D

XDD

Ditto, sav. Looks great Dien :). Although, I was imagining some swanky graphics to go along with those headings >P. I'm sure you've already got those planned x3;. Really though. Awesome job...how come we have a thumbs down smiley but no thumbs up smiley D:. Oh noes - three-eyed smiley Dx.

I agree with Stane, sir. Swanky graphics are a must, especially for the parts I'm writing.

Thanks for getting that up Dien. I'll do everything I can to have my part up ASAP.

Looks awesome, you guys.

And sorry if anything I said sounded too critical. I was just looking for some answers. Text is a very difficult medium.

Shut-in over here offers his help over the summer if needed.

I've made some suggestions of my own directly into the layouts over there, guys. Let me know if there's any sections (like the dueling or the shops, for example) you'd like me to go ahead and write, since after Kiwi goes to NY tomorrow, I'll have free time again. Looking great so far though (though I definitely agree on the Swanky Graphics bit... and honestly solicit a full web page version to put up on our Swanky Homepage.)

Ooo, I think we're also missing a "Main abilities in Subs areas" section....

I'm probably going to look into reorganizing the staff a little to fill in some of the holes, too. I believe that technically, Cent and Dien are doing about 80% of site work right now, with Sekai, the other Pawn Mods', and my occasional interference filling the remaining bit... Number one, I'd like to get myself back into circulation (since I'm supposedly head mod...) and number two, I'd like to get the staff flushed out a bit again.

Suggestions and volunteers are welcome; technically you're supposed to be at least in the "Registration-replying Capable" group before you're on staff, but if anyone really wants to help and we feel like they actually can... there may be exceptions.

Sweet! It looks really good so far. Uber detailed already. Many <3s for everyone. For the Roleplaying section, are those parts about Tournaments/Special events going to include a history of past ones? I'd find that really interesting.

I know Damek and I are always very willing to help, and not just in that 'we say we are but then we're really not' way.

Fayre speaks only the truth! Things can take the back burner a little bit while off at college, but I pop on the site at least every day I'm at home (or in the presence of a computer) so I could still do other... things... and... stuff.

I just sort of drew a blank on what, specifically, would need to be done, lol.